Twilight

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Heavenli24
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Re: Twilight

Postby Heavenli24 » Mon Sep 06, 2010 4:23 pm

Misha wrote:I think I have had better luck than you with fanfics. I've found the ones that actually filled some of the abysmal plot holes in the story. Mind you, it took me ages to find them, and then there's only a few, but some people did see the potential and wrote the story as it should have been written in the first place.

Even AU that actually take their time to build... Then again, I don't read AH (not even for Roswell...) but don't sell the entire fandom as so cringe-inducing. 98.4% of it, yeah, but not all of it :lol:


Sorry, I should have clarified that I only read AH fanfics in Twilight (I don't really have any desire to read canon fics because I don't really care that much about the books or the canon plots/plotholes) and I only went looking for them because I wanted some new all-human stories to read and I'd heard that the Twilight fandom had a lot of stories. The problem I've found though is that the majority of the AH fanfics stay so close to the canon characterisations that I just don't find the plots all that interesting to read - the stories don't capture my attention and pull me in, instead I just find myself getting bored with them and giving up partway through (it also doesn't help that alot of the stories are basically the same plot over and over again with little variation).

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Re: Twilight

Postby Earth2Mama » Mon Sep 06, 2010 10:34 pm

April wrote:I do appreciate the fact that Stephanie Meyer has concocted a vampire mythology that isn't an exact replica of the Buffy mythology, but . . . come on, sparkling? He sparkles? Ah, whatever.


You forgot ... he sparkles, yes ... but LIKE DIAMONDS! :roll:

A total Buffy/Angel rip off if ever I saw one, just minus the creativity and ingenuity of Joss Whedon. Seriously, the only reason I got into this was because of the concept of Vampires and Werewolves. And the only reason why I go to the theater to see the damn movies - in a nutshell - JACOB'S BODY. Oh man ... if he weren't jail-bait ... but I digress :D

I've always been a fan of vampire and werewolf genre and I especially love it when they interact with one another. But this whole series - including Breaking Dawn ( which I still can't move past the ending of Book 1 to Jake's side of things in Book 2 ) - left me at a 30% - 70% like/hate of Stephanie Meyers take on it.

And the majority of that has to do with Edward and Bella falling in love - I'm sorry, I didn't see any spark in the book that would have compelled them falling for each other so quickly. Beside the fact that he literally blinded her with his "beauty" - sparkly self, there really wasn't a emotional connection that I saw/read.

Now, falling in lust I can believe - as plainly shown by her being mesmerized by his "glitter" ( *snark* ) and his hunger for her blood.
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April
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Re: Twilight

Postby April » Sat Sep 11, 2010 4:23 pm

Oh my god. And not a good oh my god. An under-whelmed one. I just finished the first book, and I can't for the life of me understand the hype. My apologies to any Twilight fans out there, but . . . it's just not good. Not to me at least. It actually sickens me that Stephanie Meyer can make millions off of this when most of the writers who post on this very board will never make a cent off their writings, even though they're much more talented.

Bella and Edward are two of the most flat, uninteresting characters I've ever read about in my life. There's no depth, no dimension. She's a Mary Sue and he's a Gary Stu; it's as simple as that. For now at least. I hope to God it changes. They seemingly fall in love out of nowhere. Why every male in the story loves Bella so damn much is beyond me.

Edward is slightly more tolerable than her, I suppose, but . . . is the fact that he's cold and stone-like supposed to be a turn-on? And why must Bella reiterate over and over again that he's perfect? Gag.

What I find most disturbing is that Bella is not only willing, but actually EAGER, to be turned into a vampire. (I've read about Breaking Freaking Dawn, so I know it's going to happen.) I just envision young girls reading this and getting the total wrong message.

The bottom line: I'm going to be an English teacher, and if Twilight motivates my students to read, then I can accept and be grateful for that. But if they aren't exposed to something deeper and better at some point (like Buffy, which is clearly just miles beyond anything Twilight can ever hope to be), then that's a problem.

Again, I don't mean to offend any Twihards. If it's your thing, then it's your thing. It's just not my cup of tea. I'm going to have to read the next 3 books, though, because my roommate tries out a lot of new TV shows, books, movies, and music for me, and I owe it to her to return the favor.
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Re: Twilight

Postby Earth2Mama » Sat Sep 11, 2010 4:44 pm

April wrote:Again, I don't mean to offend any Twihards. If it's your thing, then it's your thing. It's just not my cup of tea. I'm going to have to read the next 3 books, though, because my roommate tries out a lot of new TV shows, books, movies, and music for me, and I owe it to her to return the favor.

:shock: You truly are a good friend to suffer through it. I wish you well. 8)

And maybe you can give me the courage to pick up Breaking Dawn, as I've downloaded it for free on my e-book reader, and finally finish it.

Oh lord ... give me strength! :?
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Re: Twilight

Postby April » Sun Oct 03, 2010 12:20 pm

Oh my god, it just keeps getting worse. I'm reading New Moon now, and while I find it slightly more tolerable than the first (only because of the abundance of Jacob), I'm still absolutely appalled by the message these books are sending: Bella has absolutely no concern for her own life. All she cares about is Edward. Hell, she actually fantasizes about death. She wants to DIE and become a freaking VAMPIRE all because of this guy that she seemingly fell in love with out of nowhere in the first book. So basically the message that the young girls who read this can take away with them is that it's okay to be suicidal, as long as it's a romantic suicidal. Horrible. Just horrible. This romanticism of vampirism and death is something that NEVER happened in Buffy. (Again, I cannot reiterate how vastly superior Buffy is to Twilight.) Buffy was, at its core, a show about life, about humanity. These books are about the opposite. There is nothing romantic about this love story.

Jacob is by far the only character who I can actually stand. I find Bella only slightly less annoying when she's around him, but in no means would I ever wish the punishment of being in a relationship with Bella on him. He's way too good for her and way better than Edward. Seriously, who would want a guy who is cold and stone-like over a guy who exudes warmth, both literally and metaphorically? Jacob is the only character with any depth. It's obvious that Stephanie Meyer tries to point out all the ways in which he is not Edward, which actually works in his favor and makes him all the more likable to me.
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Re: Twilight

Postby Sundae » Sun Oct 03, 2010 1:18 pm

April wrote:Oh my god, it just keeps getting worse. I'm reading New Moon now, and while I find it slightly more tolerable than the first (only because of the abundance of Jacob), I'm still absolutely appalled by the message these books are sending: Bella has absolutely no concern for her own life. All she cares about is Edward. Hell, she actually fantasizes about death. She wants to DIE and become a freaking VAMPIRE all because of this guy that she seemingly fell in love with out of nowhere in the first book. So basically the message that the young girls who read this can take away with them is that it's okay to be suicidal, as long as it's a romantic suicidal. Horrible. Just horrible. This romanticism of vampirism and death is something that NEVER happened in Buffy. (Again, I cannot reiterate how vastly superior Buffy is to Twilight.) Buffy was, at its core, a show about life, about humanity. These books are about the opposite. There is nothing romantic about this love story.


Ahh...finally. Another person that feels like I do. I was absolutely appalled and disgusted with last book and the message it was sending to young girls. The first three books we're at a level that I could justify once I debated with my self, but the last book, Breaking Dawn, there is absolutely no way that I could justify how fathom-ably age-inappropriate this book was. I was ready to throw the book out the window on how disgusted I was at the fact that 12-13 years were reading this. It was so not the right message...and I know you haven't read that. But. :( It honestly makes me sad that this book has reached so many young hands that should be getting a better message instead.

For catering to 12-13 years...SEX, PREGNANCY especially in the way this book depicted both SHOULD NOT have even been touched.

And this supposed perfect love between Edward/Bella (which I thought was really non-existent...i'm sorry, I just saw no chemistry at all) is so obsessive to the point that Bella is ready to give up everything she essentially is to acquire it...yet I just found it so ironic that when she did finally turn and got her wish to be with Edward, the love was completely imperfect.

The age thing got me too...what so bad about getting older...and why should age be such a big deal that the only right way is for the girl to be a little younger than the guy in a relationship?

There are too many things I could point out. It belongs on the banned list.
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April
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Re: Twilight

Postby April » Mon Oct 11, 2010 8:58 am

Sundae wrote:And this supposed perfect love between Edward/Bella (which I thought was really non-existent...i'm sorry, I just saw no chemistry at all) is so obsessive to the point that Bella is ready to give up everything she essentially is to acquire it...


I think part of the problem is that Bella isn't anything. She's the most Mary-Sued character I've ever read in a published piece of literature. She has no personality. All she is is Edward's lover. (I never glimpsed the chemistry, either. The dialogue between them is cliched and difficult to follow, and oh by the way, how convenient that she's the only one whose mind he can't read.) :roll: She has no aspirations for the future. We never hear about any hopes and dreams to go to college and have any kind of career (or at least I haven't so far.) The only thing she wants to do with her future is die.
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Re: Twilight

Postby Heavenli24 » Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:05 pm

April wrote:and oh by the way, how convenient that she's the only one whose mind he can't read.) :roll:


I know, and they never even really come up with a reason why he can't read her mind! It would have been interesting to read about him finding someone else whose mind he couldn't read and then them finding a common denominator link between that person and Bella.

April wrote:She has no aspirations for the future. We never hear about any hopes and dreams to go to college and have any kind of career (or at least I haven't so far.) The only thing she wants to do with her future is die.


I voiced this in a Twilight discussion thread a few months ago (the fact that Bella has no aspirations or dreams except to become a vampire) and the response I got from the fans there was along the lines of: 'Well, she was only 17 when she found Edward/her soulmate and was too young to know what she wanted to do in life then, but maybe if she had met him when she was older, she would have gone on to develop some aspirations'. My response to that was 'What 17-year-old has no aspirations or dreams whatsoever? Sure, she might not know what career she wants to do at 17, but everyone has some kind of goal or dream, no matter how young they are... is there nowhere in the world she wants to go, or nothing new that she wants to try first, or hobby or interest that she'd like to explore?' :roll:

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Re: Twilight

Postby Sundae » Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:20 pm

Heavenli24 wrote:
April wrote:She has no aspirations for the future. We never hear about any hopes and dreams to go to college and have any kind of career (or at least I haven't so far.) The only thing she wants to do with her future is die.


I voiced this in a Twilight discussion thread a few months ago (the fact that Bella has no aspirations or dreams except to become a vampire) and the response I got from the fans there was along the lines of: 'Well, she was only 17 when she found Edward/her soulmate and was too young to know what she wanted to do in life then, but maybe if she had met him when she was older, she would have gone on to develop some aspirations'. My response to that was 'What 17-year-old has no aspirations or dreams whatsoever? Sure, she might not know what career she wants to do at 17, but everyone has some kind of goal or dream, no matter how young they are... is there nowhere in the world she wants to go, or nothing new that she wants to try first, or hobby or interest that she'd like to explore?' :roll:


Oh God. Seriously? I was 17 went I graduated high school and had to make decisions about what university I wanted to go to and what I wanted to major in.

Please!

And really, the younger you are the more dreams you do have. And those dreams are the biggest, brightest and at times the most ambitious because it's not clouded with the strains of "life". I mean what eleven year old at one point or another hasn't said "Ohh...I want to be a superstar, or a singer, or a doctor, or an astronaut when I grow up?"

I know I did...and some parts of me still hold out hopes for things that I remember saying I wanted to do when I was younger.And I swear, I'm going accomplish some of those things before I die too.
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Re: Twilight

Postby April » Mon Oct 11, 2010 2:25 pm

I completely agree, both of you.

I started the third book today--though I'd be content to never read a word of Meyer's writing again.

I lol'ed at Edward and Bella's discussion of Wuthering Heights in the first chapter, because I wasn't sure if Meyer was consciously making fun of their romance or not. There's just so much to make fun of.

But in all seriousness . . . this relationship seems downright abusive sometimes. Not physically, but still . . . I hate that Edward won't allow her to be friends with Jacob because he might be dangerous. Yet he's a fucking vampire. :roll: Isn't that dangerous? And it sickens me that Bella always rationalizes his behavior.

And if I have to hear how "perfect" and "cold" he is one more time, I think I'll vomit.
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